Sunday's novice race

[mcgee16]

After Sunday’s race I am not very impressed with wmrra's track safety. In the morning safety meeting I heard them call people out like we were in high school about safety concerns (Very childish). During the start of the novice race oil was spilled all the way across t2. Wmrra red flagged the race and sent us back to the pits. Ten minutes later we were told that the oil was cleaned up and we were ready to race. On my first lap I felt my rear tire slip over the spill. On the next lap others were not so lucky. My problem is why was it not cleaned up properly, and who sign off saying that the track was safe. The track was not safe and were are lucky that nobody got seriously hurt. But when it comes down to it, the people that crashed are out thousands of dollars and it was a preventable accident. From my and other novice racers point of view there were many mistake's made by track safety. If this is what I can expect then somebody tell me now so I can reevaluate racing with wmrra.

Thanks
Scott

[Hypnotiq]

Your concerns will be brought up at the E-board meeting Wednesday evening by myself.

To answer your question on who decides when the race track is safe, it's Jeff Wieand, the Race Director and he takes it very seriously.

Thanks,
Nico

[mcgee16]

Thanks Nico, is it a club meeting that i could attend?

[valldog]

750 superbike ran 5 minutes after the novice were sent back and no crashes in that corner and they were ripping. wmrra is all about keeping riders safe. thanks for all the hard work to the VOLINTEERS

[mcgee16]

They also had advance warning about where the oil was and how to get around it. Also i notice a hand full of riders that went out on the test lap and came back because of the oil.

[pappawheelie]

Scott, I think you should step back and reevaluate your statement and allegations. I know that Jeff Wieand takes safety of the track extremely personally. I'm sure that the volunteers and club cleaned the track to the best of our abilities. I suppose they could have iused a street sweeper and water on the track and wait for it to dry? I'm not saying its anyone fault, but the club gives you a sighting lap so you can assess the track. It sucks that it didnt work out to the best outcome, But I can tell you that the person you should be mad at is the guy that dumped the oil!!

[jkaiser]

A race track, like a golf course, has hazards and obstacles to be avoided. I learned this myself this past weekend. The ideal / safest racing environment rarely exists. Practice sessions and sight in laps are critical to your survival and are there to allow you to adjust your racing line to accommodate these hazards. Learn to live with them because they never go away.

[cee-jay]

Scott, I think you should step back and reevaluate your statement and allegations. I know that Jeff Wieand takes safety of the track extremely personally. I'm sure that the volunteers and club cleaned the track to the best of our abilities. I suppose they could have iused a street sweeper and water on the track and wait for it to dry? I'm not saying its anyone fault, but the club gives you a sighting lap so you can assess the track. It sucks that it didnt work out to the best outcome, But I can tell you that the person you should be mad at is the guy that dumped the oil!!

^^^^Yes!


Huge thanks to Jeff Wieand. All WMMRA staffing I have met is very impressive, very professional. Jeff spent a fair amount of time talking to my pit mate on the 921 bike that went down in the corner on the second race.

Jeff could have easily said his .02 cents, and headed down the road for home at the end of the day--instead he took his time and helped answer questions and concerns we all had regarding the incident.

Thanks again raceday staff and cornerworkers!

cj

[gazman]

maybe if more people would corner work then that would not be a problem. I was out this weekend but still volentered to corner work on sunday. I was in t 5 all day and there were very few crashes that day. I know a couple of people that could of helped out but they were "pit bitches". my question is how did a oil plug that should be safety wired come out? Just woundering. I just wish more people would grab there friends and family to help with the safety of the track. Liz was really short the weekend again. :headscratch: Come on racers, lets get our track safer by getting more of your friends to help out. Or if you are at the track and not racing then work a conrer. You may learn a thing or two. Thanks to the novices on sunday that did corner work for half of the day before the race. That was awesome of you. Oil is a hard thing to clean up and we were on such a tight sch. anyway sorry to those who crashed.

[JCoulter]

I was standing on the inside of Turn 2 with a engine that wouldn't start (I was the mechanical on the second lap of the first start of that heat) and got to watch the flurry of activity as the WMRRA volunteers cleaned the track. They were working their asses off to make the track as safe as possible.

Nobody is perfect, but as Track Control for 2Fast, I can tell you that even when you have the best of intentions and try your damnedest to make sure that things are safe... sometimes you find that what appeared to be a cleaned track still has some residual debris or that the kitty litter you used just plain doesn't work. (The new kitty litter is NOT like the old kitty litter and does not clean up oil spills very well at all)

Jeff takes your safety VERY seriously.


I agree that the results in this case were less than ideal, but racing is not always going to put you in an ideal environment... just look at the last AMA race.

[mcgee16]

I corner worked both days. I have seen the process of cleaning oil off the track. In this case there was white powder accross 3/4 of t2. I under stand that racing is dangerous. I just think that we should have been better informed about what accutally happend and told that the inside of t2 still could be slick. One warm up lap doesnt give you enough insight of where that safe line is if your not expecting to have to find one. I as many other novice racer are still learning different lines on the track and dont have the experience that the expert racers do. If im told there was an oil spill that got cleaned up then thats what im going to believe. I dont want to take away the efforts of the people that helped clean the track and im glad that it was cleaned quickly, but i think that there was a lack of communication.

[D_Rail]

I corner worked both days. I have seen the process of cleaning oil off the track. In this case there was white powder accross 3/4 of t2. I under stand that racing is dangerous. I just think that we should have been better informed about what accutally happend and told that the inside of t2 still could be slick. One warm up lap doesnt give you enough insight of where that safe line is if your not expecting to have to find one. I as many other novice racer are still learning different lines on the track and dont have the experience that the expert racers do. If im told there was an oil spill that got cleaned up then thats what im going to believe. I dont want to take away the efforts of the people that helped clean the track and im glad that it was cleaned quickly, but i think that there was a lack of communication.If you went out when they were asking in the pits for volunteers to help clean it up then you would have known where it was, or if you read the white board to the enterance at hot pit, or if you asked anyone.

[Hypnotiq]

I corner worked both days. I have seen the process of cleaning oil off the track. In this case there was white powder accross 3/4 of t2. I under stand that racing is dangerous. I just think that we should have been better informed about what accutally happend and told that the inside of t2 still could be slick. One warm up lap doesnt give you enough insight of where that safe line is if your not expecting to have to find one. I as many other novice racer are still learning different lines on the track and dont have the experience that the expert racers do. If im told there was an oil spill that got cleaned up then thats what im going to believe. I dont want to take away the efforts of the people that helped clean the track and im glad that it was cleaned quickly, but i think that there was a lack of communication.


If you think the experts go into the corner full tilt after an oil spill, you're sadly mistaken. We do the same thing Novice racers have to do. Go through there and assess the traction that each rider/bike is getting. You pick a line till you find what works for you. Some find lines that work better than others.

In the future, enter the corner with caution and find a line that works for you. If you don't want to risk it, pull off the racing surface. Several expert 750 riders did this after the warm up lap.

-Nico

[PictureChick]

I corner worked both days. I have seen the process of cleaning oil off the track. In this case there was white powder accross 3/4 of t2. I under stand that racing is dangerous. I just think that we should have been better informed about what accutally happend and told that the inside of t2 still could be slick. One warm up lap doesnt give you enough insight of where that safe line is if your not expecting to have to find one. I as many other novice racer are still learning different lines on the track and dont have the experience that the expert racers do. If im told there was an oil spill that got cleaned up then thats what im going to believe. I dont want to take away the efforts of the people that helped clean the track and im glad that it was cleaned quickly, but i think that there was a lack of communication.

Did you not see the debris flag being displayed? You as a rider need to be watching for those flags. Where was the lack of communication? Riders were made aware that there was a large spill, (that is what caused for the delay).

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i150/us40637/track407.jpg

I appreciate the fact that you helped out corner working, but I think it might do you a hell of a lot of good to spend the day with a race day staffer such as course marshall or race director, so you could see how much is involved in keeping the riders safe.



Also regarding your earlier comment of the childishness of the morning meeting. People need to be called out when they are late for meetings or not paying attention.

[jpaulsen]

If you think the experts go into the corner full tilt after an oil spill, you're sadly mistaken. We do the same thing Novice racers have to do. Go through there and assess the traction that each rider/bike is getting. You pick a line till you find what works for you. Some find lines that work better than others.

In the future, enter the corner with caution and find a line that works for you. If you don't want to risk it, pull off the racing surface. Several expert 750 riders did this after the warm up lap.

-Nico

+1 and I agree with Nico :wow:

Personally, I chose it was not worth it to go back out. If you choose to do so, the warm up/sighting lap is intended for you to assess the track/bike/rider conditions for the upcoming race/heat. It is then up to you as a rider/racer to make the decision that is best based on current information. To believe that everything is 100% perfect after an oil spill is just not smart.

As for the rider meeting, it is all about safety. If I was one of the offending riders I would expect no less than to be called out as well. Not sure if you remember, but there was a rider killed last year in CO due to exiting the wrong way on the straight during a track day. I'll bet if you ask Tony, he has a very clear idea of the proper path to enter the track now!:D

[MadManx]

+1 and I agree with Nico :wow:

As for the rider meeting, it is all about safety. If I was one of the offending riders I would expect no less than to be called out as well. Not sure if you remember, but there was a rider killed last year in CO due to exiting the wrong way on the straight during a track day. I'll bet if you ask Tony, he has a very clear idea of the proper path to enter the track now!:D

Now that my name is brought into this, I will comment.
Here's the problem, I was not the only one who crossed the cone in the "run off area", other racers did. Also, a rider turning around against traffic in the vintage?
I was only singled out because I questioned the lack of communication, AFTER THE RACE IN THE BEER GARDEN after hearing staff BITCHING about "fuckin novices".
I NEVER STATED THAT I DID NOT CARE THAT IT WAS A SAFETY ISSUE--- it is.
The disrespect in front of your racing peers is unacceptable in an organization that says it's run professionally. Fines & suspensions levied against offenders is a better method.
That said, I will leave this behind and move forward toward my ultimate goal.
Cheers,

[mcgee16]

I guess that i underestimated the meaning of cleaned up. I was aware that there was an oil spill in t2. And never spliped on the oil on the warm up lap. All i noticed was white all over the track. I didnt realize that it was still slick was until the race started. I just think that it would help to wright a note on the white board saying " stay to the outside of T2 due to oil spill" or somthing. I have only done track days before racing and never had a problem with oil spills. So that is were my experiance is comming from. I under stand that they did the best that they could to clean it up and to get the race started again. I think that a little more info could have helped. And i helped corner work all day so im not going to jump out of my gear to go clean up the track so that can finish my race. Im not trying to bash anybody i just want to no how riders can get better informed.

[tophyr]

Yeah, it's pretty easy to expect certain things if you don't have any experience otherwise :) When I came up the hill to T2 from 4, I was amazed - it looked like a disaster area with all the people working to clean up. I damn near slipped and fell on my head when I stepped onto it :X That's actually me in the yellow t-shirt/yellow vest to the right in that photo, intentionally dragging my feet around trying to find still-oily spots that needed to be cleaned. The difference between what it was before we tackled the track and what it was after was phenomenal.

Like others have said, there was a note on the pit board and a yellow/debris flag on T2.. that's about as much of an option as we had at the time to communicate. Russ (I think it was Russ, may have been Jeff, couldn't tell) was the one to make the call to stop the race the second time. He saw the carnage that was still happening and knew that it wasn't safe for the novices, and then it's only at that point was it really apparent that the track was still very slippery.

[Lizbeth]

Now that my name is brought into this, I will comment.
Here's the problem, I was not the only one who crossed the cone in the "run off area", other racers did. Also, a rider turning around against traffic in the vintage?
I was only singled out because I questioned the lack of communication, AFTER THE RACE IN THE BEER GARDEN after hearing staff BITCHING about "fuckin novices".
I NEVER STATED THAT I DID NOT CARE THAT IT WAS A SAFETY ISSUE--- it is.
The disrespect in front of your racing peers is unacceptable in an organization that says it's run professionally. Fines & suspensions levied against offenders is a better method.
That said, I will leave this behind and move forward toward my ultimate goal.
Cheers,

Hey Tony,
Don't take it to personally. There were other people that were talked to about the same situation. As for the "f-ing novices" comment, everything has an f-ing in front of it at the track. Novices call other novices f-ing novices, f-ing racers, f-ing dragsters, f-ing rain and it goes on. I can tell you that it is not meant as in insult. Without novices the club does not continue to grow. Of course you care about safety issues, everyone does. We have 86'd others in the past that truely did not. Talk to Race Director if you have any questions.

We all are at the track to have a great time. There is bitching from all sides. Racers, staff, vendors, etc but we all seem to make it work. This really is a great bunch of people. We're happy to have you. :)

[mcgee16]

I guess that this is a learning lesson and luckly i didnt suffer from it. I cant believe that i have a real concern and all i get is people telling me that its our fault. It's disapointing that you cant ask for answers with out having to defend yourself.

[tophyr]

Shoulda heard me bitching about the vintage guys, going out and sweeping the track looking for oil in T4 after every race, lol! "f-in vintage" "f-in 160's" "f-in straight pipes" "*(!)$#" etc, hehehe.

Found out later that day that the guy working radio with me... was a vintage racer :X

edit: I don't think anyone here is saying that the crashes due to the oil were the crashee's fault, only that the race staff did everything they could practically do in order to let riders know about the situation, and that it's your responsibility to pay attention to what the race staff is telling you. Believe me when I say that nobody takes rider safety more seriously than those who run the race day.

[MadManx]

Hey Tony,
Don't take it to personally. There were other people that were talked to about the same situation. As for the "f-ing novices" comment, everything has an f-ing in front of it at the track. Novices call other novices f-ing novices, f-ing racers, f-ing dragsters, f-ing rain and it goes on. I can tell you that it is not meant as in insult. Without novices the club does not continue to grow. Of course you care about safety issues, everyone does. We have 86'd others in the past that truely did not. Talk to Race Director if you have any questions.

We all are at the track to have a great time. There is bitching from all sides. Racers, staff, vendors, etc but we all seem to make it work. This really is a great bunch of people. We're happy to have you. :)

Thanks for the clarification, I appreciate that.:beerchug:.


Now lets all move on to the next round :)

[Lizbeth]

Scott,
I gotta say I agree with Angie about spending the day with the race day staff to see what actually goes on during a race day. Come hang out with us and see what goes into a race day before, during and after. The track starts getting set up at 6 and we didn't leave until after 8, 8:30 (some later) on Sunday. That is just before and after. You should see what happens from 9-5 while there are bikes on track. Get a scanner for your pit and you will be able to hear what happens all day on the radios.

There were no less than 30 people out in turn 2 cleaning up the oil spill. There were other racers and vendors that came out with brooms to clean up the track not to mention the PR street sweeper. When there is s call to arms, people respond. There was a yellow flag and the debris flag. Racing is dangerous, safety is our priority. The sheer VOLUME of oil was huge. The race was called again due to safety. If there was no concern for your saftey you would have continued racing and we wouldn't have run the 750 race the way it was. Picking people and bikes up in corners is not a pleasant, light hearted job. Transports and airlifts are no fun.


I think perhaps your frustration should be aimed to the person that blatently and neglegently went on to the track knowing that their equipment was a ticking time bomb. Jeff, Bobby and the other race day staff involved will be addressing the issue with that person. The situation will be dealt with properly and accordingly.

[Lizbeth]

I guess that this is a learning lesson and luckly i didnt suffer from it. I cant believe that i have a real concern and all i get is people telling me that its our fault. It's disapointing that you cant ask for answers with out having to defend yourself.

I don't recall anyone saying it was your fault. I think your concerns were valid and addressed as to the fact that we DO care about safety and we did what we could. None of us would willingly put anyone at risk. As a novice you have a lot on your plate. There is a lot to learn. That is why it has been posted that there were signs and flags to inform you. This is why it is novice. The 750 class was given the option. Some of them chose to race, some didn't. It was all about comfort and risk.

Ask questions, look for answers but your post did come across as a little accusatory. (Not a great word for what I'm thinking but it felt a little harsh as a part of race day staff.) Anyone, race day staff, board, racers, etc will always try to address any concerns that you may have. This is your club. It takes everyone to participate, question, and put ideas into action to make it grow and prosper.

Only a 3 weeks until we get to race again!!!:dancingchili:

[Lizbeth]

Thanks for the clarification, I appreciate that.:beerchug:.


Now lets all move on to the next round :)

Thanks. Have a great F-ing afternoon!! :lol:

[JCoulter]

I think perhaps your frustration should be aimed to the person that blatently and neglegently went on to the track knowing that their equipment was a ticking time bomb. Jeff, Bobby and the other race day staff involved will be addressing the issue with that person. The situation will be dealt with properly and accordingly.

Care to point them out?

Seems like many know who it was, but I don't. :D

[RickRinaldo123]

After Sunday’s race I am not very impressed with wmrra's track safety. In the morning safety meeting I heard them call people out like we were in high school about safety concerns (Very childish). During the start of the novice race oil was spilled all the way across t2. Wmrra red flagged the race and sent us back to the pits. Ten minutes later we were told that the oil was cleaned up and we were ready to race. On my first lap I felt my rear tire slip over the spill. On the next lap others were not so lucky. My problem is why was it not cleaned up properly, and who sign off saying that the track was safe. The track was not safe and were are lucky that nobody got seriously hurt. But when it comes down to it, the people that crashed are out thousands of dollars and it was a preventable accident. From my and other novice racers point of view there were many mistake's made by track safety. If this is what I can expect then somebody tell me now so I can reevaluate racing with wmrra.

Thanks
Scott

Scott,

For what it is worth, I went out to help with the oil clean-up because I was in the next race (750SB) and I gotta say the track sure looked safe to me. I physically touched the pavement (in many places) and did not feel any oil on the ground. I felt the clean-up was very thorough.

However, the white stuff used to pick-up the oil has gotta make the bikes loose some traction and is certainly intimidating when you ride through it. Everything seemed OK in the 750 race and we were going through the entrance of T2 at a perty good clip. But, people were still taking different lines and being careful.

Rick...

[PictureChick]

Care to point them out?

Seems like many know who it was, but I don't. :D

I think you all will know who it is in time. :firedevil:

Thanks to all that helped clean up the mess!

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i150/us40637/track403-1.jpg[/IMG]

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i150/us40637/track411.jpg[/IMG]

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i150/us40637/track415.jpg[/IMG]

[Lizbeth]

Care to point them out?

Seems like many know who it was, but I don't. :D

I don't have a number and even if I did I wouldn't share. RD and R will address the situation. RD can elaborate on the situation if he so chooses.

[PictureChick]

I don't have a number and even if I did I wouldn't share. RD and R will address the situation. RD can elaborate on the situation if he so chooses.

I would guess that we won't be seeing them anytime soon...if ever again.

[Nex]

To add my $0.02...

A few general points:

- From what I understand 750SBK got 2 laps, one to assess the track and one to warm up.

- This is round 4, many Novice racers graduated, replaced by brand new people who have only done track days. They don't know better.

- In the pits restart looked like a scene from Pearl Harbor (the movie) with Novices scrambling to their bikes in a hurry. Many thought it was over given the spill size and did not expect to be getting out there. Result - a rather rushed entrance through the track gate, the white board got mostly ignored. (I'm guilty of that)

I'm very happy no one got hurt, and as for bikes - well that's racing for ya. However I think a bit more care should be given to situations like this when Novices are involved, after all "children are our future" :)

[Nex]

Oh and f-novice!

[Lizbeth]

To add my $0.02...

A few general points:

- From what I understand 750SBK got 2 laps, one to assess the track and one to warm up.

- This is round 4, many Novice racers graduated, replaced by brand new people who have only done track days. They don't know better.

- In the pits restart looked like a scene from Pearl Harbor (the movie) with Novices scrambling to their bikes in a hurry. Many thought it was over given the spill size and did not expect to be getting out there. Result - a rather rushed entrance through the track gate, the white board got mostly ignored. (I'm guilty of that)

I'm very happy no one got hurt, and as for bikes - well that's racing for ya. However I think a bit more care should be given to situations like this when Novices are involved, after all "children are our future" :)

We will always do our best to communicate with racers. We can't personally speak to every rider before or after a race. Our communication with riders is the white board and flags. there were notes written and a yellow and debris flag out. I know with nerves and adrenaline it's a lot to remember. I think it was a good learning experience for all of the novices.

I'm sure there was a scramble in the pits. There is always a hurry up and wait in situations like this. Just remember, we will ALWAYS try to get back to a hot track as quickly as possible whether it is a downed rider or oil, etc. Until racers are notified otherwise they should assume we will will be trying to get them out again asap.

It was a difficult situation for all involves. Thank goodness that no one seriously got hurt! I'm still a little hacked :mad2:at the F-tard that caused the whole problem.

[Will]

Well, we all know exactly what an f-tard really is now. If he ever shows up at the track again, we should steal his battery so he can't go out and make a mess.

[tophyr]

Nah, let him have his battery.. just drain his oil!

[PictureChick]

Nah, let him have his battery.. just drain his oil!


el ohh el..(lol):lmao::lol::lmao:

and on the back of his leathers it needs to say "i'm the T2 F-tard!"

I hope he is reading the forums!:bash:

[PictureChick]

845 Do Kwang Kim Kaw ZX6R. Be cautious around this rider. Sorry for being an asshole, but it is time for some accountability. You indirectly cost me and a few other riders a lot of money. Luckily none of us are hurt to badly. By the comments of one of the downed riders I do believe you ended his season. Wait to go. I sure hope that you are proud of yourself. Unfortunately I feel that I have to assume part of the responsibility. I crashed on the second start. I was telling myself to be cautious in turn two the whole time we gridded up, but I forgot all about the oil when the light went out. Inexperience I guess.
Anyway thanks again #845 I hope that I never race with you again. I just can't afford to.

There ya go, the beans along with the oil has been spilled.

[tophyr]

I thought Do Kim was the guy who crashed at PIR and broke his back.. are there two?

edit: Apparently there are.. Do from PIR is #513.

[ckoth]

His brother hurt himself at PIR from what I understand.

[BDF]

They are brothers, big Do and little Do. Both great guys and contribute to the racing comunity.Having a hard time thinking it was not thought out that it would be a problem.There both the type of racers you would want in your org.

Warren

[Lizbeth]

They are brothers, big Do and little Do. Both great guys and contribute to the racing comunity.Having a hard time thinking it was not thought out that it would be a problem.There both the type of racers you would want in your org.

Warren

I'm sure that they are great guys but that was an inexcusable action. I am not a racer, I am not a mechanic. I just learned how to change my oil and plugs last week. I have enough common sense to know better than to put a stripped bolt ANYWHERE! I don't care if you use silicone, super glue, duct tape, whatever, it is a stripped bolt! I know people want to race but fix it properly! If it's not fixed, you don't race. It's that simple. Especially when it is something as serious as OIL! We are lucky that there were not any serious injuries. As it is, we have riders that are out financially due to pure negligence. I know racing is racing, bikes fall down but it sucks when it was something that was preventable. I just still thank the Lord that no one was seriously injured. That is all that really matters.

[cee-jay]

Great guys DON'T put other peoples lives/health/finances in jeopardy by being cheap or doing something out of convenience. Blah.

[BDF]

Great guys DON'T put other peoples lives/health/finances in jeopardy by being cheap or doing something out of convenience. Blah.



Well if I were you I would thing about not griding up. Corner workers, Tech and Race Directors do an out standing job. They can not protect against everything or everyone THATS WHY THEY CALL IT RACING!!

I am not justifying his maintaince program.But what happens when its you doing the boneheaded THING?:firedevil:

[chunke1]

In response to all the comments let me just say that although my brother and I have very similiar names, we are in fact very seperate and different people.

I cannot explain his actions nor the reasoning behind it (as is the case with many things he has done over the years) but will say no malice was intended. That's just not him. The only thing I can do is offer my apology.

Please accept my sincere apology for the events of this Sunday in addtion to the hardship it has caused. I have to take some of the blame here as I was supposed to be up at PR for the race weekend but could not. If I was there, this incident would not have happened.

If any of you would like to speak with me personally, please send me a PM to exchange information.

Regards,

Do Kim (OMRRA #513)

[chunke1]

And as a final note, his track career is over from all accounts. Many people in his life (including me) are happy about that.

[tokin]

And as a final note, his track career is over from all accounts. Many people in his life (including me) are happy about that.
that makes me kinda feel bad :(

[El Cuervo]

I know Do from around the pits. He is one of the nicest people I have met - a very mild mannered person.

The decision to do what he did was obviously not a good one, and I am sure he is regretting it right now.

Hopefully we can learn from this as an organization.

P.S.

I for one am happy that WMRRA is 95% composed of anal retentive, OCD, freaks who spend all of their free time wrenching and polishing their bikes. Except me. I am not that way.

[PictureChick]

In response to all the comments let me just say that although my brother and I have very similiar names, we are in fact very seperate and different people.

I cannot explain his actions nor the reasoning behind it (as is the case with many things he has done over the years) but will say no malice was intended. That's just not him. The only thing I can do is offer my apology.

Please accept my sincere apology for the events of this Sunday in addtion to the hardship it has caused. I have to take some of the blame here as I was supposed to be up at PR for the race weekend but could not. If I was there, this incident would not have happened.

If any of you would like to speak with me personally, please send me a PM to exchange information.

Regards,

Do Kim (OMRRA #513)

That shows a lot of class! You can not be responsible for your brothers lack of judgement.

He needs to step up to the plate!

[tjones23]

In response to all the comments let me just say that although my brother and I have very similiar names, we are in fact very seperate and different people.

I cannot explain his actions nor the reasoning behind it (as is the case with many things he has done over the years) but will say no malice was intended. That's just not him. The only thing I can do is offer my apology.
<snip>



For me it was just an inconvenience -- my 4th and last race of the day was shortened, T2 was dirty, but once I figured out where to be it was OK and I got to race.
For others it was much more of a problem. While ignorance and/or stupidity might explain, they surely don't excuse*.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanlon's_razor

Tim
#413

* We've all done stupid things, however maybe I've been smart enough or lucky enough to bear the brunt of the costs of my stupidity.

[ckoth]

In response to all the comments let me just say that although my brother and I have very similiar names, we are in fact very seperate and different people.

I cannot explain his actions nor the reasoning behind it (as is the case with many things he has done over the years) but will say no malice was intended. That's just not him. The only thing I can do is offer my apology.

Please accept my sincere apology for the events of this Sunday in addtion to the hardship it has caused. I have to take some of the blame here as I was supposed to be up at PR for the race weekend but could not. If I was there, this incident would not have happened.

If any of you would like to speak with me personally, please send me a PM to exchange information.

Regards,

Do Kim (OMRRA #513)

Thank you for speaking up for your brother. I am sorry for my abrasiveness. From this post on, this is a dead subject to me.

[Motophotog]

Did you not read CeeJay's earlier posts acknowledging the great work that the WMRRA staff do? If not I suggest you read and get caught up before you open your mouth again. Your mouth spews ignorance.

No kidding Captain Obvious! They can't protect us from everything. This is the only thing you said that is right. Obviously.

If your definition of THATS RACING includes racing with knowingly faulty equipment that could hurt other, then you are an idiot and WMRRA is nothing about that.

WMRRA"s staff #1 goal is SAFETY. Because of the great job that the staff does believe me they are discussing this situation and what do you want to bet that they treating it more than a boneheaded thing.One more thing, siliconing a drainplug by your definition is a bonehead thing. So what you are saying is, "yet stupid, but excusable"? News flash bright guy this beyond bonehead. You greatly concern me with your definition of bonehead behavior.

step away from the keyboard. Have a beer. Return. Discuss.

[Motophotog]

If any of you would like to speak with me personally, please send me a PM to exchange information.

Regards,

Do Kim (OMRRA #513)

Definitely heard around the pits down in Oregon that you're a stand up guy. I was the one who posted up to wonder if you were ok or not, on the other forum. Glad to see you're doing better, though I was very angry about the bone headed move, I know we all make mistakes. It added fuel to the fire because we practiced first, and raced second to last. We sat there for 7.5hrs for one 5 lap race. Its not the best time to discuss any of the events. Luckily for me I had airfence to do afterards, so all my energy and anger was taken out on the damn airfence :bigsmile:

At any rate, you dont need to speak on your brothers behalf. I think people wanted to hear it from him, glad ur healing well, see you at the next OMRRA event perhaps!

[ckoth]

step away from the keyboard. Have a beer. Return. Discuss.

OK smartass, let's discuss.

[BDF]

Did you not read CeeJay's earlier posts acknowledging the great work that the WMRRA staff do? If not I suggest you read and get caught up before you open your mouth again. Your mouth spews ignorance.

No kidding Captain Obvious! They can't protect us from everything. This is the only thing you said that is right. Obviously.

If your definition of THATS RACING includes racing with knowingly faulty equipment that could hurt other, then you are an idiot and WMRRA is nothing about that.

One more thing, siliconing a drainplug by your definition is a bonehead thing. So what you are saying is, "yet stupid, but excusable"? WMRRA's staff #1 goal is SAFETY. Because of the great job that the staff does


believe me they are discussing this situation and what do you want to bet that they treating it more than a boneheaded thing. News flash bright guy this beyond bonehead. You greatly concern me with your definition of bonehead behavior.


HEY ASSHAT send me a pm and i'll give ya my address and phone. Then we can discuss your pro active attitude easier too bitch about something you no very little about than get involved and help out!

[PictureChick]

OK smartass, let's discuss.

So you had a beer? Good Boy!:beerchug: Could not resist.:lol:

[Motophotog]

HEY ASSHAT send me a pm and i'll give ya my address and phone. Then we can discuss your pro active attitude easier too bitch about something you no very little about than get involved and help out!

Rugh roh. you just pissed off a dude thats 5'11" 250lbs of muscle :couch:

[ckoth]

So you had a beer? Good Boy!:beerchug: Could not resist.:lol:

Sorry! I think it is time for me to have a beer.:beerchug:

[PictureChick]

Sorry! I think it is time for me to have a beer.:beerchug:

Yeesh, back at ya, i'm buying!:beerchug: lol

[ngng]

If im told there was an oil spill that got cleaned up then thats what im going to believe.

if you believe that a some absorbent and brushes will make that track will be oilfree after a spill, you need to reevaluate more than just racing

go out, evaluate your traction, then make a decision. nobody is forcing you to ride balls out

[ericande]

Sorry! I think it is time for me to have a beer.:beerchug:

I'd say we should go out for a beer but even if we met halfway I think it'd take much too long.

[ngng]

Please let me know if this has escalated from a forum discussion with two different opinions to threatening my life. With what I do for a living, I don't take threats lightly.

uh oh, time to bust out the ethug.txt

[PictureChick]

uh oh, time to bust out the ethug.txt

Heay heay heay, let's not go there! We are all entitled to an opinion, you know the saying, ............everybody has one.

No threats, just opinions!

I think we can all agree!

We are a family here! We won't always agree.

[ckoth]

I'd say we should go out for a beer but even if we met halfway I think it'd take much too long.

You are right. Even meeting halfway would be quite the journey. Maybe someday when we are on the same side of the state.

[ericande]

You are right. Even meeting halfway would be quite the journey. Maybe someday when we are on the same side of the state.

Bring Jim and we can have some PBR.



oh and Revhard is joking, he's being a revtard. I could post pics of his gut to prove he's kidding.

[BDF]

Now why do you want my address? So we can bang heads. :bash:How old are you?

Look here man. Do you know anything about me? How involved am I? You apparently have the answers, yet have know idea who I am. In the future before you make accusations about an individual I suggest you know a little information about that individual. It won't make you look so ignorant. Please dispute my thoughts. Excuse me, I mean my "BITCHING".

Let me get this strait. I know very little about oil drain plugs that are siliconed to keep them inplace. You are right once again. It is so far from acceptable that it would have never crossed my mind. But than again this type of action does not require much common sense to discuss.

I am done. obviously we have a different opinion.



Enough said by me,please look me up next wmmra round and you can tell me all you know and I will gladly listen.At the same time you can sign up for some corner working.

WMRRA 14
OMRRA 140

[Will]

Rugh roh. you just pissed off a dude thats 5'11" 250lbs of muscle :couch:

:lmao: And it is rippling, thundering muscle, too!

[jbcjr]

:lmao: And it is rippling, thundering muscle, too!

I'm pretty sure Darren is talking about Big Brones :lol: Who is CKOTH anyway and what's with the attitude????

[Motophotog]

uh oh, time to bust out the ethug.txt

:rofl:


oh and Revhard is joking, he's being a revtard.

:twofinger: I wasnt kidding.

I'm pretty sure Darren is talking about Big Brones :lol: Who is CKOTH anyway and what's with the attitude????

haha. thats who BDF is Jim. :bigsmile: :burnout:

Anyway, this is stupid. :headscratch:

[jbcjr]

:rofl:




:twofinger: I wasnt kidding.



haha. thats who BDF is Jim. :bigsmile: :burnout:

Anyway, this is stupid. :headscratch:

ya i know bdf is warren... am i missing something?

[Motophotog]

Point was he's sitting screaming from the sideline and admits he doesnt know much about the situation. Its one of those talk less listen more situations. BOD said they'd look into it and they did. So thats why people were getting pissed at the screaming. Thought id clarify.

Group hug?

[PictureChick]

Group hug?[/quote]

Count me in!:clap:

[NoControl74]

This thread got off the rails rather quickly. For a minute I thought I was over at PNWriders. :lol:

I know Cody, and he is a good guy. I have met Warren, and he is a good guy too (but he can't program a scanner to save his life...) it seems like a few beers in the pits are in order.

[dawtips]

The guy in the red hat is sexy. Agree? Disagree?
I think you all will know who it is in time. :firedevil:

Thanks to all that helped clean up the mess!

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i150/us40637/track403-1.jpg[/IMG]

[ericande]

Congrats to Jim for his first expert race!


http://sloweric.smugmug.com/photos/352103845_L7aXJ-M.jpg



PS, your leathers look a little ragged :banana:

[PictureChick]

The guy in the red hat is sexy. Agree? Disagree?
Disagree, lol:couch:

Only playing!

[Motophotog]

Congrats to Jim for his first expert race!


wrong.

His first was in OMRRA. :beerchug:

http://darrenbeattyphotography.smugmug.com/photos/351798635_TjkQo-XL-1.jpg

[Motophotog]

Disagree, lol:couch:

Only playing!

oh snap. Angie comin outta left field to :hurl: on jared. :popcorn:

[Motophotog]

The guy in the red hat is sexy. Agree? Disagree?

I'd rather just stare at Rick's ass in those leathers :leghump:

[ericande]

why so underexposed D?






hehe

[Motophotog]

why so underexposed D?



hehe

lol that picture is the seks. ;) :thumbsup:

[RickRinaldo123]

I'd rather just stare at Rick's ass in those leathers :leghump:


Perty Hot Huh! I figured there would be someone out there taking pics so I added the belt to make my waist look smaller and buttocks firmer!

[Will]

PS, your leathers look a little ragged :banana:

His leathers look loved.

[jbcjr]

Congrats to Jim for his first expert race!


http://sloweric.smugmug.com/photos/352103845_L7aXJ-M.jpg



PS, your leathers look a little ragged :banana:

Thanks E! Now all you need to do is get on a liter bike :firedevil:so we can continue mixing it up... as far as the leathers, well I guess I don't look like a poser anymore :crazy2: I'm more pissed about trashing my new helmet!

[chunke1]

His brother hurt himself at PIR from what I understand.

I didn't hurt myself. The pavement did that for me :bigsmile:

[chunke1]

Definitely heard around the pits down in Oregon that you're a stand up guy.

Filthy Lies!!!

At any rate, you dont need to speak on your brothers behalf. I think people wanted to hear it from him, glad ur healing well, see you at the next OMRRA event perhaps!

He's family.....what can you do?

I'm actually doing good, just a sore back like I pulled it. I think old age is contributing to it though. Next OMRRA round, swing over to the Taste of Racing area near Start/Finish. I'll be helping out being masta pit bitch for my friends.

[richardlpalmer]

uh oh, time to bust out the ethug.txt

Don't make me ban you...

[theJrod]

Great guys DON'T put other peoples lives/health/finances in jeopardy by being cheap or doing something out of convenience. Blah.Good people or not, +one million to this.

Well if I were you I would thing about not griding up. Corner workers, Tech and Race Directors do an out standing job. They can not protect against everything or everyone THATS WHY THEY CALL IT RACING!!

Nobody is saying this sport isn't inherently dangerous. We all know it is.
That's exactly why there is no place for stupidity and lack of common sense because it places even more unnecessary danger on the participants.
I am not justifying his maintaince program.But what happens when its you doing the boneheaded THING?:firedevil:There's a little thing called common sense that would prevent me from EVER siliconing my stripped drain plug, safety-wiring it to cheat tech, and expecting it to hold.

[ckoth]

I didn't hurt myself. The pavement did that for me :bigsmile:

:lol: .I hope your back gets better and you can get back out there racing in the near future. Good luck to you and your brother. I sincerely mean that. Maybe I will see you on the track sometime. I will be erasing all my negative posts. I hate drama.

[ckoth]

Hey Tony,
Don't take it to personally. There were other people that were talked to about the same situation. As for the "f-ing novices" comment, everything has an f-ing in front of it at the track. Novices call other novices f-ing novices, f-ing racers, f-ing dragsters, f-ing rain and it goes on. I can tell you that it is not meant as in insult. Without novices the club does not continue to grow. Of course you care about safety issues, everyone does. We have 86'd others in the past that truely did not. Talk to Race Director if you have any questions.

We all are at the track to have a great time. There is bitching from all sides. Racers, staff, vendors, etc but we all seem to make it work. This really is a great bunch of people. We're happy to have you. :)

The f-ing corner captain is the best. Thanks Liz in helping me find Will last weekend. You are always very helpful. Thank you.

[ckoth]

Yeesh, back at ya, i'm buying!:beerchug: lol

:banana:

[ckoth]

This thread got off the rails rather quickly. For a minute I thought I was over at PNWriders. :lol:

I know Cody, and he is a good guy. I have met Warren, and he is a good guy too (but he can't program a scanner to save his life...) it seems like a few beers in the pits are in order.

Thanks man. If everything works out and I get all my parts in I will see you in a couple of weeks Jason. Aug 30th and 31st is my last opportunity to race this year, so I am scrambling to try and get my bike and gear fixed before the weekend. That turn two crash could have been so much worse. I am hoping that my helmet is functional. I sent it off to SHOEI a few days ago to be tested. I have a feeling that it is not going to pass:sad:.

[pscook]

I am hoping that my helmet is functional. I sent it off to SHOEI a few days ago to be tested. I have a feeling that it is not going to pass:sad:.

If you don't mind, I would like to see any "official" communication from Shoei regarding the damage to your helmet. I have heard of people doing this, but I have never seen any of the results in person. It would be nice to show people the process to get a helmet inspected.

[ckoth]

Bring Jim and we can have some PBR.



oh and Revhard is joking, he's being a revtard. I could post pics of his gut to prove he's kidding.
:hurl:

PBR is a bad word Eric. Jim if you see this I am only kidding. "No Jim", my beer has not won a blue ribbon. PBR is the best beer in whole entire world. Sorry I mean universe!

[ckoth]

OK smartass, let's discuss.

Darren I forgot one. Just kidding. :twofinger: Not really.

[BDF]

Good people or not, +one million to this.



Nobody is saying this sport isn't inherently dangerous. We all know it is.
That's exactly why there is no place for stupidity and lack of common sense because it places even more unnecessary danger on the participants.
There's a little thing called common sense that would prevent me from EVER siliconing my stripped drain plug, safety-wiring it to cheat tech, and expecting it to hold.


No disrespect too anyone,but he said, she said, they said, we heard,MY .02 is volunteer to do something pro active not debate something that is over.

I myself should help out wmrra/omrra more on race weekend or off season for that matter.
Some of you know me and my bikes you could eat off them I take personal pride knowing they are race ready any time.

Most of wmrrra /omrra members would give you the time or parts too help a fellow racer.So I just have a hard time when people assume w/ out all the facts.

Again wmrra 14/omrra 140

Come and find me I'll hopefully be pitted close to registration we'll shake hands and see if we can help instead of assume.

:bigsmile:

[ckoth]

If you don't mind, I would like to see any "official" communication from Shoei regarding the damage to your helmet. I have heard of people doing this, but I have never seen any of the results in person. It would be nice to show people the process to get a helmet inspected.

I don't mind at all Phil. I will let you know when I find out the results. The process for the most part is very simple. If you get on their web site it tells you exactly what to do. One of my pit mates has been through this process and he was more than happy the way Shoei treated him. Great service. At the next WMRRA race weekend during tech inspection, I will tell you how the experience was for me.

[ckoth]

Wow! I am utterly speachless due to a kind gesture. Another racer just PM me and offered me his extra bike to race with at the end of the month if I was unable to get my bike ready for the race weakend. Thank you again to the racer who offered me his bike, but I could never accept. What an incredible offer. Thanks again.

Why am I posting this? Because it is this type of personality that I have seen in the pits, that makes me want to be part of a club like WMRRA.

Karma can be good or bad, but you my friend have earned lot's of good Karma with your kind gesture. I think you should go sign up for 600 SS, because I think with all of your good Karma, those other racers don't stand a chance.

I will have to come and shake your hand right after I shake Warren Brones hand:razz:.

Warren I hope you know that I am kidding and I seriously would like to discuss anything about racing with you. I am not sorry about our difference of opinions on this matter, but I am sorry for some of the harsh statements that I made. I could have worded them much better. I am over being upset with the situation. Once again I am a lot to blame for the situation, because I did not think about the hazerdous corner when I was overtaken by the red mist. A rookie mistake that I hope I don't repeat. I am pretty sure that I will be ready in time to race at the end of the month. Spending a lot of money and not knowing if I would be ready to race at the end of the month made me very upset. Once again sorry for the wrong choice of words.

I hope that I get good Karma points for this:bigsmile:.

[PictureChick]

:hurl:
PBR is the best beer in whole entire world. Sorry I mean universe!

I can only hope you are kidding:hurl:, oh wait never mind you are from Idaho, that sounds about right.:lol::couch:

[ckoth]

I can only hope you are kidding:hurl:, oh wait never mind you are from Idaho, that sounds about right.:lol::couch:

Ouch! :bigsmile:

[late apex]

I can only hope you are kidding:hurl:, oh wait never mind you are from Idaho, that sounds about right.:lol::couch:

Do NOT mock the PBR!

[cee-jay]

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g80/sctnabt/pbr2.jpg

[Mic]

Do NOT mock the PBR!

Ok...























We'll just continue to mock you :banana:

[Lizbeth]

The f-ing corner captain is the best. Thanks Liz in helping me find Will last weekend. You are always very helpful. Thank you.

Thanks!!:inlove: I certainly love being at the track. :)

[dokim]

Hey Guys,
Im the one that caused the oil spill in turn 2 on sunday. First i would like to apologize for any damage that was caused by my oil spill. I already told jen sorry, but ill say it again. I went through tech inspection and all was fine, i double checked the bolt before i left for the race and the bolt felt tight and there was no oil leakage. I ran 2 days the weekend before in portland and the AF track day without incident. It was totally unintentinal, and never thought the plug would blow out. Wish i never went out. I really do feel bad for what happened, it was actually suppose to be my last day of racing and motorcycles, after my previous high side and my brothers crash, and of course the wife and parents concerns i was leaving motorcycling. Unfortunately my last day was not a great day. Sorry again guys.

I also wanted to thank the track officials and volunteers, they worked their butts off trying to get the oil cleaned up.

Big Do

[PictureChick]

I went through tech inspection and all was fine, i double checked the bolt before i left for the race and the bolt felt tight and there was no oil leakage.
I also wanted to thank the track officials and volunteers, they worked their butts off trying to get the oil cleaned up.

Big Do

I appreciate you coming forward, however, you should have been well aware that, that the bolt was compromised and should not have taken the risk you did, you were very lucky that Jen and the others were not more seriously injured, I have nothing against you (and I really mean that), but your sense of judgement is beyond excusable, you could have killed some one and because of that.

With that said, again I thank you for coming forward and I am very glad that you yourself was not injured.:clap:

I will wait for my bashing here on the forums, but it needed to be said!

FRIENDS DON'T LET FRIENDS DRINK PBR:rofl:

[thom2002]

mac and jack for the win!

you guys hailing the PBR sound like frat boys haha

[PictureChick]

[QUOTE=thom2002;45728]mac and jack for the win!

You got that right!

[Nefarious]

Being that I'm not (yet) involved in WMRRA, and wasn't at the race... What exactly happened? I'm assuming from Do's post that his oil plug just 'fell out'. So I'm curious... do you guys not use safety wire???? How would a tech inspection miss that?

Just trying to figure this thread out :D

[jpaulsen]

He used silicone to make the plug stay, then safety wired it to make it look legit. Tech only inspects, they don't clip the wire and wrench the plug to see if it's actually tightened.

[Nefarious]

Ah, thanks for clarifying, I actually understand the thread now :)

[cee-jay]

^^Pun intended?