Armor and leathers

[The Squid]

I am trying to get started racing and so far have purchased leathers and some body armor including back protecter, elbow pads, and knee pads. The suit I bought used came with some soft armor on the elbows, knees, and back. Would it be working against anything if I used both? The ones inserted into the suit and the strap ons? I am most concerned about the elbows because the suit is a little large and can be twisted around the elbow area pretty easily which I am pretty sure you don't want to happen in a crash. Haveing the extra padding in the knee and back area fills up the suit a bit but is it ok?

Thanks

[Lauralynne]

I am trying to get started racing and so far have purchased leathers and some body armor including back protecter, elbow pads, and knee pads. The suit I bought used came with some soft armor on the elbows, knees, and back. Would it be working against anything if I used both? The ones inserted into the suit and the strap ons? I am most concerned about the elbows because the suit is a little large and can be twisted around the elbow area pretty easily which I am pretty sure you don't want to happen in a crash. Haveing the extra padding in the knee and back area fills up the suit a bit but is it ok?

Thanks
Have you tried putting it all on and sitting on the bike - can you move about comfortably, can you move on and off the bike as if racing without it getting in the way or does it bind and twist and distract you - that's the #1 question. If you bought quality leathers, you shouldn't need anything but the additional back protector...what kind of leathers did you buy?

[Mr Sunshine]

If you bought quality leathers, you shouldn't need anything but the additional back protector...what kind of leathers did you buy?

I also prefer a chest protector.

[Lauralynne]

I also prefer a chest protector.

I've got OEM airbags ;)

[The Squid]

Yes I have ridden my street bike with the leathers on to get a feel for them. The suit is a joe rocket, is used, and fits a person about 50 lbs heavier than me. Begginner equipment, you know. All areas feel great when riding, the neck is a little tight but no big deal. I was just curious if two sets of armor would cancel each other out in a way.

I recently saw the post for the chest protector company based in Portland. I'm saving up for one now :)

[Lauralynne]

Yes I have ridden my street bike with the leathers on to get a feel for them. The suit is a joe rocket, is used, and fits a person about 50 lbs heavier than me. Begginner equipment, you know. All areas feel great when riding, the neck is a little tight but no big deal. I was just curious if two sets of armor would cancel each other out in a way.

I recently saw the post for the chest protector company based in Portland. I'm saving up for one now :)

leathers that are too big will catch and make you tumble rather than slide, they pinch and rash your skin and while better than nothing are still not safe. Save your money and get better fitting leathers, having armor under them isn't going to make them safer.

[The Squid]

Ok thanks. I was thinking I could just save the money and gain 50 lbs ;) Just kidding, thanks again for the advice.

[Lauralynne]

Ok thanks. I was thinking I could just save the money and gain 50 lbs ;) Just kidding, thanks again for the advice.

Gaining weight? I'm an expert at that! ;)

[The Squid]

Haha I know what you mean. Is there anything worn underneath the leathers? Like a cotton liner or something like that?

[hibernian]

Go to http://www.helmetharbor.com/ and check out the Psycle skins. Teknic and Joe Rocket make an underliner, too...UnderArmour is always a good solid choice as well. You wont want to be thrashing about trying to get those damn leathers off without some sort of underliner.

[skidmarx]

Ok thanks. I was thinking I could just save the money and gain 50 lbs ;) Just kidding, thanks again for the advice.
You can still get them adjusted for your size. Believe me - you don't want to have them that large in a fall - you will tumble instead of slide, like Laura mentioned.

[The Squid]

Thanks, great site. I am completly new and everything helps. :D

[The Squid]

Wow, the responses come faster than I can reply. Skidmarx, maybe I am exagerating, I will attach a picture and maybe that will help.

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b350/willis806/suit_small.jpg

P.S. The picture was taken about 3 seconds before the smile was present, believe it or not I was very happy :P

[Lauralynne]

Ok - I say this with respect for budget and in the least non-judgemental way possible:
The helmet is roughly 15-20 years old - not only won't it pass tech but it's downright dangerous (you THINK you're protected). But I'm assuming that's an actual helmet you wear for safety. Maybe it's not. In any case...please don't assume it's going to save your melon, it likely won't.
The leathers are WAAAAAY to big and are also not going to do much to protect you, better than shorts and flip flops but dangerous to race in. In the case of a crash, they'll pinch your skin, rash you with their twisting and likely catch the ground and turn your simple slide into a bone breaking tumble. I would get them relisted as soon as possible and find some that fit better. Leathers should be snug. That's how they're designed.

I understand budget issues but we're talking about racing here. More so than on the street, it's not "if" you're going to crash, it really is "when" and "how". Only a small percentage of our club has bottomless wallets and "budget" is a key word in our vocabulary. But before that is safety. I really don't want to rain on your parade but unless you can afford better equipment, you might consider putting off racing for a year and save the pennies.

PS. is it an option to have the leathers taken in? There's several leather alteration locally who do great jobs...maybe at least get an estimate on it?

[The Squid]

Oh I totally understand. I dont even have boots yet. I am saving up for some and a new agv helmet. That shoei is DOT 85... a little old. Being jobless and attending school I do need to put things off until I can make the income positive. Thanks for all the help. Maybe I can sell them to my dad :p They would fit him. I am crouched over a bit, I will try to get some pics later of me standing up. I do know I am going to crash, it is a part of racing. Even before I start racing I am thinking of 3 things ranked in order:

protection
performace
presentation(looks)

[Lauralynne]

Oh I totally understand. I dont even have boots yet. I am saving up for some and a new agv helmet. That shoei is DOT 85... a little old. Being jobless and attending school I do need to put things off until I can make the income positive. Thanks for all the help. Maybe I can sell them to my dad :p They would fit him. I am crouched over a bit, I will try to get some pics later of me standing up. I do know I am going to crash, it is a part of racing. Even before I start racing I am thinking of 3 things ranked in order:

protection
performace
presentation(looks)

PS. the leathers should fit tight while on the bike - they should rack your nuts standing up in them...
What size leathers do you wear? Or pants size/height weight/etc.... I can help keep an eye open for something - one idea is to post to Craigslist that you've got a size whatever leathers and you need to trade for smaller ones - I'm sure there are quite a few people out there who's leathers have, um, shrunk ;)

[The Squid]

Hmm well there definately is "pressure" there but I dont know if it falls in the "racking" category ;) I am 6ft 1 weigh 150 lbs, waist is about 31 inches. I'll check out craigslist too, thanks

[Mr Sunshine]

PS. the leathers should fit tight while on the bike - they should rack your nuts standing up in them...
What size leathers do you wear? Or pants size/height weight/etc.... I can help keep an eye open for something - one idea is to post to Craigslist that you've got a size whatever leathers and you need to trade for smaller ones - I'm sure there are quite a few people out there who's leathers have, um, shrunk ;)

Like you budget comes after safety. So I spent some big change on custom fitting kangaroo leathers. Let me say that when I first got them I thought they were too small. I could barely the the pant portion over my thighs and putting my arm in to the sleeve was difficult. When I zipped up the suit it was like "Damn this is tight". But I knew they were the right size. Fast forward a few track days and my leathers loosened up (leather does this...I understand it'll stretch upwards of 20% from new). It now fits like a glove.

This is what you are looking for from your leather. A overall snug fit. I crashed once where the suit was a tad to large for me. Got a little rasberry on my right elbow from the armor shifting out of the way and wearing though that part of the fabric. If the armor had stayed in place it would have to wear through the hard portion of the armor. I destroyed that suit so I got my custom fitted leathers.

Go to http://www.burgiracing.com and take a close look at my picture. What you see in my arms and legs is padding. If other photos from that same season that Bones took you can see the padding even more. This is because the suit is tight enough that the leather is stretched. Anything that looks to be loose is really just twisted around from working the bike. Oh if you look at my body please remember I'm fat and I have a thick back protector and thick chest protector on. :)

So I would either really bulk up alot or go down at least 2 suit sizes. It should only be comfortable on the bike in a tuck. If it is comfortable any other time then its not fitting right.

Racing can be done on a budget but before you even think about it, you will end up spending some good money on good, well fitting gear.

[Mr Sunshine]

Haha I know what you mean. Is there anything worn underneath the leathers? Like a cotton liner or something like that?


I wear long sleeved and long panted Underarmor under my leathers. Technically I should not as they could melt when sliding down the pavement and the heat is generated. I've fallen before with them on and this didn't happen so I'm willing to take my risk vs always being uncomfortable in my leathers due to sticking to them.

[The Squid]

Right I remember reading that under armor can melt or anything with plastic in it for that matter. I just checked the size and it is a 46. Would a 44 be too short vertically? Or by two sizes do you mean a 42? (unsure if they make odd numbered leathers). It makes sense that you would want the leathers tight, just didn't know it could be so bad to wear loose ones. "Bulking up" probably wont happen, I'm a long distance runner and extra upper body weight isnt fun to carry 10 miles... :P Where did you get your hip pads? I have looked ar armor at a few sites and have only come across, shoulder, elbow, back, knee, and recently chest thanks to another posting. I have some for dirtbike riding but they are a little "thin" for pavement usage I believe.

[Lauralynne]

46 is too big for me and I'm a big girl! a 42 might be closer at least. You should post up on Craigslist, there's likely someone out there with leathers hanging in their closet who is looking at them wishing they hadn't put on that extra 40 pounds...
If you get a chance, you might head to a local gear shop and try some stuff on. Get an idea of what does fit and how - sizes run differently among brands.

[The Squid]

Alright. I still think I will try to sell them to my dad also. They definately would fit him. After xmas I'll go in and try things on. Should I bring the armor I have or do shops usually have some that they would let people use? Is it alright to do that if I dont intended to buy it then or do some do sizing just for the sake of sizing?

[Lauralynne]

Alright. I still think I will try to sell them to my dad also. They definately would fit him. After xmas I'll go in and try things on. Should I bring the armor I have or do shops usually have some that they would let people use? Is it alright to do that if I dont intended to buy it then or do some do sizing just for the sake of sizing?

Just be up front with them - they may or may not appreciate it. It's pretty likely you'll be back at some point to shop there....

Bring the armor, can't hurt. But I think that you'll find that if the suit fits right, there's no room for the elbow/knee armor and the suit should have adequate armor. the chest and back protector need to fit though...


(PS. Thanks for taking this all so well - some people might have taken it differently and not listened to advice - we're not trying to tell you how to do things, not at all. We're trying to pass along information, it's up to you to take the information or ignore it...worth every cent you paid ;) )

[The Squid]

First of all I'm just glad people are replying :) I listen and try to gather advice (politely of course) from anyone willing to provide. I figured out early on that learning from people who have been through what you want to do already saves a lot of time and trouble, in almost everything. You have to accept that you dont know how to do things and cant get mad if someone tells you that something you did was "wrong". Its all a part of the learning process and I know I have to go through that if I ever want to race in AMA or ... the GP level :cool:

I'll do just that. Go into a shop, try on some leathers and find a size small enough to rack my balls :P Thanks again.

[Steve]

Hmm well there definately is "pressure" there but I dont know if it falls in the "racking" category ;) I am 6ft 1 weigh 150 lbs, waist is about 31 inches. I'll check out craigslist too, thanks

To give you an idea on size, I m almost identical to you and I wear a 40 to a 42. 44 or higher is way too big. (I'm 5'11'' and 160lbs).

[The Squid]

Thanks Steve, I really bought them thinking that a little big would be ok and the fitting like a glove was somthing to be achieve later. Now that I know it has a lot to do with the protection of the rider (me :cool: ) then I'll concentrate on getting a smaller suit.

[CBRmania]

You can do a quick search on ebay for 1 piece suit and find all kinda of possibilities. Alpinestars, Tecknic, Joe Rocket, Moto GP are all excellent suits at decent prices. Good thing is race season is 3 mths away so you have some time to do some "shopping" and you dont have to buy it right away. Take your time and try on as many as you can. I personally like the Moto GP leathers and tried them on at Hinshaws motorcycle in Auburn and was sitting on the show room bike in about every position you can imagine.

[The Squid]

Ok I'm looking around and thinking I might have to get one altered a bit. Most of the sizing charts I am comming across say 32 waist is a 30-40 but height of 5'10"-5'11".

[Steve]

Here's a pretty good site from the wera bbs. The Hein Gericke suit at 549.95 delivered is a great deal...

http://sportbiketrackgear2.homestead.com/stghomepage.html

[The Squid]

Thanks dude, I'll check that out when I get closer to getting the replacement. $549 is a good deal. Have you had any experience with cow hid vs. kangaroo?

[Mr Sunshine]

Right I remember reading that under armor can melt or anything with plastic in it for that matter. I just checked the size and it is a 46. Would a 44 be too short vertically? Or by two sizes do you mean a 42? (unsure if they make odd numbered leathers). It makes sense that you would want the leathers tight, just didn't know it could be so bad to wear loose ones. "Bulking up" probably wont happen, I'm a long distance runner and extra upper body weight isnt fun to carry 10 miles... :P Where did you get your hip pads? I have looked ar armor at a few sites and have only come across, shoulder, elbow, back, knee, and recently chest thanks to another posting. I have some for dirtbike riding but they are a little "thin" for pavement usage I believe.


My hip pads are integrated into my leathers.

[Mr Sunshine]

To give you an idea on size, I m almost identical to you and I wear a 40 to a 42. 44 or higher is way too big. (I'm 5'11'' and 160lbs).


Oh and an FYI I'm 5'9" and 195 and I wear close to a 42 but I have to go custom mostly because the legs are too long for me.

[The Squid]

Alright, there is more padding in the rear area on my suit, just not a removeable pad or anything. So I might be looking at a 38-40 or so? Thats smaller than I originally thought.

[snake]

You will probably be too tall for 40. You need to find some leathers for a tall skinny guy.

[The Squid]

You will probably be too tall for 40. You need to find some leathers for a tall skinny guy.


What notation would the suit have if it were longer than normal? What brands have this? Thanks

[Moto]

What notation would the suit have if it were longer than normal? What brands have this? Thanks

you can have a suit tailored to you.

get the right length...they can tighten it up for you.

of you can get a custom sized suit via Spidi/Dainese, AlpineStars, Arlness etc...

[The Squid]

you can have a suit tailored to you.

get the right length...they can tighten it up for you.

of you can get a custom sized suit via Spidi/Dainese, AlpineStars, Arlness etc...


Ok so what if I happen to maybe perhaps have a 46... could I get that tailored down to a 42? Meh... meh? ;)

[whtnxt?]

I have used off-the-shelf Frank Thomas year-old one-piece from Cycle Gear. They also have a discount program if you quailfy (MSF, Military, etc.)
Crashed twice in it and no broken bones. Sprained shoulder though, helmets were KBC VR-1 (new model is VR-2). UK size 44, Euro 54, American I am 6'0", 190-200 Lbs (depends if it was light beer or dark). A shop in north Tacoma did some modification and repair work at decent price, consider looking around for someone local to do it is my recommendation.
If you don't have the gear (I used street Alpinestar Stage GTX my first 2 race weekends before enough dough was acquyired for the real boots), take it easy out there, you have to finish the race to graduate.

[The Squid]

I have used off-the-shelf Frank Thomas year-old one-piece from Cycle Gear. They also have a discount program if you quailfy (MSF, Military, etc.)
Crashed twice in it and no broken bones. Sprained shoulder though, helmets were KBC VR-1 (new model is VR-2). UK size 44, Euro 54, American I am 6'0", 190-200 Lbs (depends if it was light beer or dark). A shop in north Tacoma did some modification and repair work at decent price, consider looking around for someone local to do it is my recommendation.
If you don't have the gear (I used street Alpinestar Stage GTX my first 2 race weekends before enough dough was acquyired for the real boots), take it easy out there, you have to finish the race to graduate.


You think I can just grab some scissors and cut pieces out then sew it back up again? ;) What was the name of the shop that did your modification work?

[Hypnotiq]

Victoria A, in Bellevue. Does a lot of work for WMRRA racers. :)

[The Squid]

Victoria A, in Bellevue. Does a lot of work for WMRRA racers. :)


Thanks man

[Moto]

leathers that are too big will catch and make you tumble rather than slide, they pinch and rash your skin and while better than nothing are still not safe. Save your money and get better fitting leathers, having armor under them isn't going to make them safer.

lose leather will also have a tendancy to catch and tear when you're sliding. he can also take them to be fitted...or at least try.

[The Squid]

lose leather will also have a tendancy to catch and tear when you're sliding. he can also take them to be fitted...or at least try.


Have you had any leathers fitted/patched? What does that usually cost? Would it be possible to make a size 46 fit me? I'm a bit taller for my weight 6'1" and 150 lbs so by waist size I should be a 42 but height wise a 46 still is a bit tight.