Please vote no on propose fuel rule

[shematt145]

Yes - running $25-30/gal race gas does seem silly but so does proposing a rule that is not well thought out and researched. You already admit that you are not sure what the vintage guys are running. How about GP bikes? Do you know that some of the newer ones that come from Japan are set up to run unleaded race gas? Or how about my GP bike that I have been running for 10 years on 110 leaded race gas? Sure I could convert to AV gas but all my jetting notes are based on 110. Your rule would actually cost me a lot of money by having me pay for dyno time to reset up four motors and a multitude of pipe and cylinder configurations that I already have copious notes on.

-Shellie

Proposal #3 - Section G.4
Howard Crow submitted the following proposal:
Section G.4
Old rulebook text:
"New Section"

Proposed new rulebook text:
"The following fuels are the only fuels allowed in all WMRRA Classes. The fuels may be mixed in any combination.
Running anything other than these fuels will result in a disqualification.
a. 92 Octane Pump Unleaded Pump Gas
b. 100 Octane Low Lead Aviation Fuel
c. Sunoco 260GTX "

Reason:
"Having folks running $25-30/gallon race gas in these economic times seems very silly. I might be missing a low cost
fuel which we could add. not 100% sure what the vintage guys run. I have added the Sunoco gas here because it is the
AMA spec gasoline and people who run AMA need to run it as even leftover pump gas can trigger a disqualification in
AMA."

[S4rs888]

Where or how do we vote on rule changes?

[Mr Sunshine]

Where or how do we vote on rule changes?

You don't. You tell your rider rep your opinions and they convey them in the rule committe meeting.

Doesn't hurt to also tell the rest of the E-Board as they'll be in the rule committe meeting.

[Mr Sunshine]

Oh and Shellie I totally agree with you!

[Seraphim38]

100 octane AV gas is horrible for bikes; it is meant for low rpm engines that change rpm very slowly or very little. As an intermediate fuel, there are much better options IMO.

[Mr Sunshine]

100 octane AV gas is horrible for bikes; it is meant for low rpm engines that change rpm very slowly or very little. As an intermediate fuel, there are much better options IMO.

Yes like letting us choose what we want to run. :bigsmile:

[Speeddealer]

AV100 gas is better than the horrible stuff that comes out of gas station pumps :D but it is not a H.P. fuel.

I agree with Shellie that the rule can't really work for club racing. Not cause she just gave me $20 either. It would sure make things nice for the few of us doing AMA rounds though..just not good for the club rule wise.

[pscook]

AV100 gas is better than the horrible stuff that comes out of gas station pumps :D but it is not a H.P. fuel.

I agree with Shellie that the rule can't really work for club racing. Not cause she just gave me $20 either. It would sure make things nice for the few of us doing AMA rounds though..just not good for the club rule wise.

I need to raise my rates! She only gave me a dollar. But I'm still against the fuel rule. Mostly because I would be the one covered in stinky gas at the end of each race and I smell bad enough as it is.

This rule would be too hard to police. Race gas provides a level of stability for tuners with some gains. Yes, the high dollar fuels do provide an increase in performance; however, I do not believe that having a spec fuel rule would "level the field" and allow mid pack racers to have a chance against the fast guys. This from a back marker. I know that race gas does not make me faster, but it does allow me to have a consistent tune for my engine. On my carb'd bikes I needed race gas to smooth the closed to open throttle transition. Beyond that, it didn't do anything for me or the bike.

[Ed Who?]

Yes - running $25-30/gal race gas does seem silly but so does proposing a rule that is not well thought out and researched. You already admit that you are not sure what the vintage guys are running. How about GP bikes? Do you know that some of the newer ones that come from Japan are set up to run unleaded race gas? Or how about my GP bike that I have been running for 10 years on 110 leaded race gas? Sure I could convert to AV gas but all my jetting notes are based on 110. Your rule would actually cost me a lot of money by having me pay for dyno time to reset up four motors and a multitude of pipe and cylinder configurations that I already have copious notes on.

-Shellie

Proposal #3 - Section G.4
Howard Crow submitted the following proposal:
Section G.4
Old rulebook text:
"New Section"

Proposed new rulebook text:
"The following fuels are the only fuels allowed in all WMRRA Classes. The fuels may be mixed in any combination.
Running anything other than these fuels will result in a disqualification.
a. 92 Octane Pump Unleaded Pump Gas
b. 100 Octane Low Lead Aviation Fuel
c. Sunoco 260GTX "

Reason:
"Having folks running $25-30/gallon race gas in these economic times seems very silly. I might be missing a low cost
fuel which we could add. not 100% sure what the vintage guys run. I have added the Sunoco gas here because it is the
AMA spec gasoline and people who run AMA need to run it as even leftover pump gas can trigger a disqualification in
AMA."


What a DUMB ass rule!! Sorry but i have a lot of guys that run Rtech R110 or even VP C12 mixed with pump gas cause they have too! Pump gas is pure SHIT nowadays...it really is that bad! you cant even run it in a bone stock 750 nowadays without some detonation! then as far as the "$25/gal" gas??? whatever!! I know that Chancy never ran that and yet was up front (as much as chubby kid on a 5 year old bike can be) and i know that Ross could run C12 $6 gal gas and smoke almost everyone else on $25/gal MR12... so stop blaming the fuel!

if you get beat and blame the fact he is using MR12 at a track like Seattle then your an idiot..honestly, YES it does help and YES it is worth it to some folks, but not everyone.

Whats next? Proposals to run STOCK OEM tires cause "$500/set for Ntechs is ridiculous"??? come on...this had to be a joke proposal??

[Ed Who?]

100 octane AV gas is horrible for bikes; it is meant for low rpm engines that change rpm very slowly or very little. As an intermediate fuel, there are much better options IMO.

+10000. well put. I never recommend it. For my guys with higher compression that cant afford $$$ fuel or for trackdays...grab a 5g pail of VP C12 or Rtech R110 and mix it 25% to 75% pump and it will run fine, not detonate (how common is this nowadays huh??) and yet only raises your fuel cost by $1.75/gal!!! come on folks.... a buck seventy five a gal for a few gals use worth fxxxking up your $2-4k engine??? no thanks :bash:

[Mr Sunshine]

you cant even run it in a bone stock 750 nowadays without some detonation!

That's interesting and pretty freaking lame!

[tophyr]

I like the idea of a fuel rule, for Supersport classes only, but instead of using an approved fuels list, using a banned additives list. That would be both easier to test for and police, and fairer manufacturer wise.

So, although I definitely agree with Howard's thinking that the fuel costs are ridic and you shouldn't have to juice to run at the front in SS classes (SB and GP classes I think are game on, biggest gun wins), I gotta be against this one in its current form.

If there's any kind of support for what I described however, I'd be more than happy to do the research to see if we could ban certain substances that'd cause the power-adding fuels to pop. (I have no problem with people running R110 or C12 or the likes in a SS class.)

[Mr Sunshine]

If you go down a banned list that list would be even harder to police than a good list.

This is club racing. Give it up.

[fuzzy]

The problem with this rule proposal is that even though you may have a spec fuel. There are many others including myself that can cheat this rule and you will never find it unless you take it to a chemist lab and even then, there is less than a 40 percent chance that you will find the mods to the spec fuel.

Like Dorn says. A rider is going to win reguardless but just like any spec item. There are always around it.
Do yourself and the club a favor. Don't waste your time. The club spends enough money of other useless things already.

[Ed Who?]

The problem with this rule proposal is that even though you may have a spec fuel. There are many others including myself that can cheat this rule and you will never find it unless you take it to a chemist lab and even then, there is less than a 40 percent chance that you will find the mods to the spec fuel.

Like Dorn says. A rider is going to win reguardless but just like any spec item. There are always around it.
Do yourself and the club a favor. Don't waste your time. The club spends enough money of other useless things already.
Ding ding ding! Yep you won't be able to accurately without doubt prove/test fuel without huge cost to club!

There are a hundred other ways to cut cost of racing...racing TWO Ducz is not one way :)

[Hypnotiq]

Definitely not for this one. :)

[Speeddealer]

BTW I know of more than one national class won on Av gas back in the dark old days so relax on the internet surfing for fuel Specs.

There is no reason to run it now with so many other options (price out a 55g drum of Trick if you are on a tight budget) but Av gas is still better than pump.

We loose 3.5% H.P. on an R6 going from $8 Pump/R110 mix to the $28 a gallon stuff.

What we need to concentrate on is getting a good beer sponsor for the trophy Presentation on Sun. Priorities!

[Mr Sunshine]

BTW I know of more than one national class won on Av gas back in the dark old days so relax on the internet surfing for fuel Specs.

Dave just a note. From what I understand AV gas has changed in recent years. So I don't know if that matters but something I read on the internet. :lmao:

[Speeddealer]

Oh so you are one of those guys!:rofl:

Its true last I used Av Gas was 2003

[MadManx]

100LL AV Gas smells good out of the pipe, but not as good as race gas.

[Mr Sunshine]

Oh so you are one of those guys!:rofl:

Its true last I used Av Gas was 2003

Naw I use good fuel...R-Tech or VP. Though I gotta soon make up my mind for next year.